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Deleted User
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18:18 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
I cant do more than keep explaining the reasons why. Other people seem to get it and understand it. It's not like I just dream any of these things up for no reason!!!

As I said before, the only alternative I could think of was to rotate twice through the game types. If people think that's a better way in future then I am sure they will post here (assuming people even want it to continue after this season).

As for where the competition sits in the forum, I think that's a little bit petty, and not to mention disrespectful. And that's not even taking into account the use of words like 'rewarding luck', 'ruining' and 'ridiculous'.

The format is what it is. It was announced ahead of it starting and there were no comments raised. There are now, fortunately, a huge number of format choices available for clan players. Everyone will have their own views on each one. Personally I now cannot stand playing 15 frames in FCL matches but I accept that others love it.

And finally anyone is free to introduce their own format of tournament at anytime if they think they can do it. I am sure bluenose, horse, jem, mousey and myself would be thrilled to see new ideas.
Deleted User
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18:21 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
And finally anyone is free to introduce their own format of tournament at anytime if they think they can do it. I am sure bluenose, horse, jem, mousey and myself would be thrilled to see new ideas.


And I wouldnt?
Deleted User
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18:26 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
And finally anyone is free to introduce their own format of tournament at anytime if they think they can do it. I am sure bluenose, horse, jem, mousey and myself would be thrilled to see new ideas.


And I wouldnt?


lol well I am sure you would but I was only mentioning the principle League runners to shorten the number of names I posted. As I said yesterday I am a lazy person.

No offence intended in omitting anyone.
Deleted User
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18:30 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
giving bonus points for golden breaks is rewarding luck...fact
ruining-wasn't talking about this competition said that about dgen wanting to bring it into FCL
I think it's ridiculous promoting this as a new FCL competition, (you wanted it to replace individual league originally if I'm not mistaken) but you've gone with the same rules you made up for FSL

Yes potlimit the arguments do fall down because with golden breaks and runouts counting as extra the game can be over a lot more quickly, before you get to your favourite game type than without them.

None of you have answered how it is controlled who breaks, you seem to miss the point that 9 frames doesn't even split into 2 evenly.
If 2 players get a run out each every frame one will lose because one player gets to break more times.
That's if the computer somehow recognises that it is player b's turn to break at the start of the next set of 3.
Just naturally setting up games 1 person will break 6 times and 1 will break 3

you really haven't thought this through properly have you chris
Deleted User
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18:34 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
Yes everything that you have posted was considered. Do you really want the thought process behind every single bit you have posted because I can let you have it if you want?

Its not promoted as a new FCL competition at all. I think the first paragraph in the first post is pretty clear on that point.
dgeneratio
dgeneratio
Posts: 38,097
18:35 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
either way lee frames has to be ODD at the end anyway or players can tie which is not what we want, chris posted the format ages ago and no one had a problem until now.

regarding wanting to bring into FCL, it is my opinion doesn't mean it will happen and i haven't presented it as an idea on the discussion thread.

i think its fine the way it is, you don't have to play in it if its that insecure.
Deleted User
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18:57 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
9 frames players couldn't tie before you add bonus points actually dgen with bonus points they can.

Just like you to answer the points chris the reason you gave for adding the bonuses was to make sure it goes to the last set of games yet you can end up 5 up after the first set of 3 games with bonus points.and....
mainly though the fact that you can't control who breaks and one person will probably end up breaking 6 times and his opponent 3 so how can that be fair?
How can you have a competition where it's not actually possible for the 2 competitors to achieve the same score?
In FSL you can do it because it's 2 frames of each, a break each this is 3 frames of each it doesn't work for it...simple
Deleted User
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18:59 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
And finally anyone is free to introduce their own format of tournament at anytime if they think they can do it. I am sure bluenose, horse, jem, mousey and myself would be thrilled to see new ideas.


And I wouldnt?


lol well I am sure you would but I was only mentioning the principle League runners to shorten the number of names I posted. As I said yesterday I am a lazy person.

No offence intended in omitting anyone.


Np, just think I was the only other league runner you didnt mention.
dgeneratio
dgeneratio
Posts: 38,097
19:01 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
9 frames players couldn't tie before you add bonus points actually dgen with bonus points they can.

Just like you to answer the points chris the reason you gave for adding the bonuses was to make sure it goes to the last set of games yet you can end up 5 up after the first set of 3 games with bonus points.and....
mainly though the fact that you can't control who breaks and one person will probably end up breaking 6 times and his opponent 3 so how can that be fair?
How can you have a competition where it's not actually possible for the 2 competitors to achieve the same score?
In FSL you can do it because it's 2 frames of each, a break each this is 3 frames of each it doesn't work for it...simple

even if its 2 of each and you both earn same number of announcements its still tied so 1 extra frame must be played therefore making breaks uneven again so in theory theres no such thing as a perfect system
bluenose1872
bluenose1872
Posts: 22,512
19:02 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
Your league staff

Eh i don't mind what the format is really, in all honesty this is Chris's league so to speak and Myself and Sarah allow it to include the FCL and FBL. End of the day Chris you are the runner of it and the FSL hosts it. I will gladly go with any format that you wish to implement.
Deleted User
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19:06 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
Your league staff

Eh i don't mind what the format is really, in all honesty this is Chris's league so to speak and Myself and Sarah allow it to include the FCL and FBL. End of the day Chris you are the runner of it and the FSL hosts it. I will gladly go with any format that you wish to implement.


You called me individuals league runner babe
bluenose1872
bluenose1872
Posts: 22,512
19:09 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
Lmao
Deleted User
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19:29 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
I'm sorry chris for entering into a discussion about the pros and cons of the way you have decided to run this competition; it was never my intention to criticise the format you have decided to play with. Am only interested in hearing different views in the hope that 'one format to please all' is actually possible. Never meant to suggest that you've done wrong.

As I said right from the start: "
It's an interesting format and i for one am looking forward to seeing how it all works out - great to have an all inclusive indivdual competition.

No doubt there'll be teething problems, but if we all remain calm, message our opponents, be mindful of the rules, deadlines and difficulty the competition runners will face in this inaugural championship, I'm sure it'll be a success.
"

now leettttssss pllaaaayyyyy POOL!!!
Deleted User
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19:33 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
9 frames players couldn't tie before you add bonus points actually dgen with bonus points they can.

Just like you to answer the points chris the reason you gave for adding the bonuses was to make sure it goes to the last set of games yet you can end up 5 up after the first set of 3 games with bonus points.and....
mainly though the fact that you can't control who breaks and one person will probably end up breaking 6 times and his opponent 3 so how can that be fair?
How can you have a competition where it's not actually possible for the 2 competitors to achieve the same score?
In FSL you can do it because it's 2 frames of each, a break each this is 3 frames of each it doesn't work for it...simple

even if its 2 of each and you both earn same number of announcements its still tied so 1 extra frame must be played therefore making breaks uneven again so in theory theres no such thing as a perfect system


The 2 frames is a league system ties are ok in a league system
3 frames of each without bonus points for run outs and GB's you don't get any ties and you get results based on who is best at the game.
Deleted User
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19:37 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
Lee - do you not sometimes read the arguments you type?

If 2 players get a run out each every frame one will lose because one player gets to break more times.


In any game with odd numbers of racks that will happen anyway regardless of run outs or gb's - clan or site tournaments of any format.

How can you have a competition where it's not actually possible for the 2 competitors to achieve the same score?


Like the site tournaments on here?

I have explained why it's preferable to try and extend the percentage of games that will realistically reach the third game type. I have given an alternative I considered, which you haven't commented on, but the reason I went against that was because I did not want ordinarily an even number of racks with the increased likelihood of draws and then tie-breakers. The third option is to rotate the game types with an even number of racks of each game type on one rotation and an odd number of racks on the second rotation. Sounds great but unless you go with 2 and 1 or vice versa you are left with 2 and 3 or vice versa and you suddenly have longer length games than I thought the majority of people would want.

You have already stated you dont want to play Super League games, now I assume you are heading towards not wishing to play these games? As I have said I dislike intently 15 rack FCL games now but I will still play them.

pot - I welcome positive discussions
Deleted User
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20:00 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
I really can't see that it is going to extend games at all, if anything they will be over far more quickly but that's a matter of opinion.
I'll play in this I like the idea of a massive knockout tournament for everyone (I am a bit competitive after all)
I just don't agree with the priciple that a run out or golden break makes you more deserving of a victory.
Would just prefer the person who has played the best in the 9 frame format getting the win...strange notion I know.
Also think that if you can't fit something like that in fairly then you can't have it in there which is the case with the number of breaks.
Way you could do it with a straight 9 frame tournament no bonuses is 1st player picks the 1st game type, 2nd player picks the 2nd lot better in my opinion.
Deleted User
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20:14 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
Still not perfect or fair though is it? Who decides who picks first game type with the possible psychological advantage of getting 3-0 up? I am guessing the first name out that I have drawn but still not ideal.

And as for fitting it in fairly, yes someone gets to break more than the opponent. If I could guarantee that it would be split 5 to 4 then yes that absolutely would be better. But ultimately that is still no different to me playing you in any tournament. I break first in games 1 and 3 and run out or GB in those. You are out because there is nothing you can do about it.

The low percentage of run outs and GB's also means the likelihood of them actually affecting the vast majority of games is small so clearly the player winning 5 of the 9 racks will in most cases win the match. But with an increased likelihood that those matches will at least get to game type 3.

Thats it from me anyway now.
poolbiird
poolbiird
Posts: 4,772
22:35 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
bunrzybhoy doest want to play, just posting this now so i dont forget. ive kept the messages just incase
Deleted User
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22:51 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
OK thats fine - thank you
Deleted User
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23:42 Sun 4 Mar 12 (GMT)  [Link]  
i have contacted my opponent, dee. I want to play, will see if dee does.
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