FCL League Discussion Thread (3)
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02:30 Tue 3 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
Yeah think 3 weeks for the group games. Possibly 2 for the rounds up to quarters beyond that a week should be plenty. Need numbers before you can really plan a schedule though.
03:31 Tue 3 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
Yeah like i said before i really need to get fixture numbers before anything.
Yeah think 3 weeks for the group games. Possibly 2 for the rounds up to quarters beyond that a week should be plenty. Need numbers before you can really plan a schedule though.
Yeah like i said before i really need to get fixture numbers before anything.
18:06 Tue 3 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
It was increased so a clan who had lost i the league could not win the league over a clan who had not lost in the league. Wont be changed.
Jay's talking about clans winning team fixtures. I'd like to remind everyone it's debatable whether that's what should matter most. I fear the day a clan wins without winning the most frames throughout the season.
Going by fixtures, the whole season can be decided in one 2 week period, I don't think that represents the whole season as accurately as simply counting frames. No bonus points needed, they just raise the luck factor.
Don't expect to sway anyone's opinion.
My point is, I'm with punkpoet, 10 was a good compromise of the different opinions.
Edited at 15:10 Tue 03/09/13 (BST)
Id like to change the bonus points, 20 points for a win is alot.
Atm its 20 for a win and 10 for no defaults.
I think reduce the 20 down to 10.
Atm its 20 for a win and 10 for no defaults.
I think reduce the 20 down to 10.
It was increased so a clan who had lost i the league could not win the league over a clan who had not lost in the league. Wont be changed.
Jay's talking about clans winning team fixtures. I'd like to remind everyone it's debatable whether that's what should matter most. I fear the day a clan wins without winning the most frames throughout the season.
Going by fixtures, the whole season can be decided in one 2 week period, I don't think that represents the whole season as accurately as simply counting frames. No bonus points needed, they just raise the luck factor.
Don't expect to sway anyone's opinion.
My point is, I'm with punkpoet, 10 was a good compromise of the different opinions.
Edited at 15:10 Tue 03/09/13 (BST)
20:21 Tue 3 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
shouldnt be no fixtures till after new year over xmas be to many defaults can u have a bonus point if u getwithin 10 points of another team means every frame counts
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20:56 Tue 3 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
It was increased so a clan who had lost i the league could not win the league over a clan who had not lost in the league. Wont be changed.
Jay's talking about clans winning team fixtures. I'd like to remind everyone it's debatable whether that's what should matter most. I fear the day a clan wins without winning the most frames throughout the season.
Going by fixtures, the whole season can be decided in one 2 week period, I don't think that represents the whole season as accurately as simply counting frames. No bonus points needed, they just raise the luck factor.
Don't expect to sway anyone's opinion.
My point is, I'm with punkpoet, 10 was a good compromise of the different opinions.
Edited at 15:10 Tue 03/09/13 (BST)
Idea? Winner Decided by
The amount of frames won accumulated with the completion bonuses and the amount of points gained throughout the entire season, not just frames.
Maybe the scoring system used in the Doubles Premier League might be best used here too, 3 points for the individual win, 5 points for the teams overall win, 2 points for the losing side for completing the fixture ONLY.
That way Everyone's awarded some points, puts emphasis on the Captains to complete matches
Id like to change the bonus points, 20 points for a win is alot.
Atm its 20 for a win and 10 for no defaults.
I think reduce the 20 down to 10.
Atm its 20 for a win and 10 for no defaults.
I think reduce the 20 down to 10.
It was increased so a clan who had lost i the league could not win the league over a clan who had not lost in the league. Wont be changed.
Jay's talking about clans winning team fixtures. I'd like to remind everyone it's debatable whether that's what should matter most. I fear the day a clan wins without winning the most frames throughout the season.
Going by fixtures, the whole season can be decided in one 2 week period, I don't think that represents the whole season as accurately as simply counting frames. No bonus points needed, they just raise the luck factor.
Don't expect to sway anyone's opinion.
My point is, I'm with punkpoet, 10 was a good compromise of the different opinions.
Edited at 15:10 Tue 03/09/13 (BST)
Idea? Winner Decided by
The amount of frames won accumulated with the completion bonuses and the amount of points gained throughout the entire season, not just frames.
Maybe the scoring system used in the Doubles Premier League might be best used here too, 3 points for the individual win, 5 points for the teams overall win, 2 points for the losing side for completing the fixture ONLY.
That way Everyone's awarded some points, puts emphasis on the Captains to complete matches
21:13 Tue 3 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
@cke1982 - That is why i am going to try and work the schedule so the new season would finish before Christmas. Bonuses for losing games within 10 points of a team won't happen, have said this before im sure.
@krazyash_07 - FCL won't be doing individual wins. The scoring for overall win and completion is fine as it is. The above would just become complicated in the long run.
@krazyash_07 - FCL won't be doing individual wins. The scoring for overall win and completion is fine as it is. The above would just become complicated in the long run.
23:45 Tue 3 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
sounds good about xmas it had to happen or there would be to many defaults but teams getting destroyed have nothing to play for if every frame counted at least they get something to play for at the end of it
01:02 Wed 4 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
They get completion for finishing all games, if you want extra points for finishing about 10 points behind the other team then why isn't the other team getting points for finishing 10 in front including the bonuses they already get...
01:26 Wed 4 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
I'm backing Jay on that one, I'm against more bonuses.
By the way, every frame is counted,
It's just out-weighed by the massive points bonus for fixture wins.
By the way, every frame is counted,
It's just out-weighed by the massive points bonus for fixture wins.
01:54 Wed 4 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
It is out weighed for a reason though. Would you be happy if Professionals won every game in a season but lost the league because of some frames? (Taking no bonuses in to account)
I for one would be annoyed at being unbeaten but losing the league if it was happening to Untouchables.
If you take away the bonuses from both Pros and UT right now then you are 20 points worse off as we would be even closer to you which would be unfair as you and your team deserved to win the tie in the end as the score proved.
I'm backing Jay on that one, I'm against more bonuses.
By the way, every frame is counted,
It's just out-weighed by the massive points bonus for fixture wins.
By the way, every frame is counted,
It's just out-weighed by the massive points bonus for fixture wins.
It is out weighed for a reason though. Would you be happy if Professionals won every game in a season but lost the league because of some frames? (Taking no bonuses in to account)
I for one would be annoyed at being unbeaten but losing the league if it was happening to Untouchables.
If you take away the bonuses from both Pros and UT right now then you are 20 points worse off as we would be even closer to you which would be unfair as you and your team deserved to win the tie in the end as the score proved.
02:12 Wed 4 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
Your choice of wording says it all, points out our difference in opinion. I don't see team fixtures as games, I see frames as games.
I'd be annoyed that my clan lost, but I wouldn't claim we deserved to win.
We'd be 27 ahead instead of 47, more accurate I believe.
Imagine if Untouchables had just barely beaten us in the team fixture we had, but not quite taken the lead in frames.
Your bonus for fixture wins would have given them the lead anyway, even though they hadn't won the most frames throughout the season.
Reflecting the whole season represents a clan's skill more accurately than reflecting the results of a 2 week period (one team fixture).
I'd be annoyed that my clan lost, but I wouldn't claim we deserved to win.
We'd be 27 ahead instead of 47, more accurate I believe.
Imagine if Untouchables had just barely beaten us in the team fixture we had, but not quite taken the lead in frames.
Your bonus for fixture wins would have given them the lead anyway, even though they hadn't won the most frames throughout the season.
Reflecting the whole season represents a clan's skill more accurately than reflecting the results of a 2 week period (one team fixture).
02:13 Wed 4 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
We're not gonna change each other's mind. How about a compromise? Take it back to 10. It would be a lot less likely, but still possible to win the most frames, and fail to win the league.
With 20 points, it's likely to be decided by one team fixture, no more accurate than a cup competition.
Edited at 23:51 Tue 03/09/13 (BST)
With 20 points, it's likely to be decided by one team fixture, no more accurate than a cup competition.
Edited at 23:51 Tue 03/09/13 (BST)
02:41 Wed 4 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
itd only be if a lower team in league done it to a team higher in league
They get completion for finishing all games, if you want extra points for finishing about 10 points behind the other team then why isn't the other team getting points for finishing 10 in front including the bonuses they already get...
itd only be if a lower team in league done it to a team higher in league
03:58 Wed 4 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
been thinking about this, really?
That was a close match 66-54,
if scored by individual fixtures 4-4
6 frames away from a draw.
If counting only frames, my team got 12 more points than yours.
Your method gave us 32 more! Was unfair to you if you ask me.
Edited at 01:01 Wed 04/09/13 (BST)
as we would be even closer to you which would be unfair as you and your team deserved to win the tie in the end as the score proved.
been thinking about this, really?
That was a close match 66-54,
if scored by individual fixtures 4-4
6 frames away from a draw.
If counting only frames, my team got 12 more points than yours.
Your method gave us 32 more! Was unfair to you if you ask me.
Edited at 01:01 Wed 04/09/13 (BST)
05:15 Wed 4 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
Teams are rewarded for winning their game, it is just like football with three points to the winner but in the FCL it is 20 (10 for a draw instead of one & zero for a loss).
In football you 95% of the time win the league because of the points you have accumulated through the season with winning games, drawing and losing them.
You have an opinion and your entitled to it like anyone else, but you are one of the lets say 10% that see it that way. If you go unbeaten in the league (even if you have lower frames for and lower frame difference) you still deserve to win the league.
In football you 95% of the time win the league because of the points you have accumulated through the season with winning games, drawing and losing them.
You have an opinion and your entitled to it like anyone else, but you are one of the lets say 10% that see it that way. If you go unbeaten in the league (even if you have lower frames for and lower frame difference) you still deserve to win the league.
05:37 Wed 4 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
Doesn't change the fact that my way would be more accurate, representing the whole season, instead of one team fixture ( as u call it , a game), Might as well not have a cup anymore, you're scoring the league pretty much the same way, no difference between the 2.
If you want the team fixtures to decide the league(no compromise), then you might as well not even bother counting frames.
I realize I'm outnumbered here, I was in one vote anyway, but I think it's a lot more than 10% who feel my way.
If you want the team fixtures to decide the league(no compromise), then you might as well not even bother counting frames.
I realize I'm outnumbered here, I was in one vote anyway, but I think it's a lot more than 10% who feel my way.
05:41 Wed 4 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
Did someone mention extending the length of a season?
I think that's the only way you could score completely by team fixtures, and still be more accurate than a cup.
If everyone played each other twice, rather than once.
Because I strongly believe that one team fixture shouldn't be enough to decide a whole season, you should be able to re-take the lead by beating every other team by bigger margins.
I think that's the only way you could score completely by team fixtures, and still be more accurate than a cup.
If everyone played each other twice, rather than once.
Because I strongly believe that one team fixture shouldn't be enough to decide a whole season, you should be able to re-take the lead by beating every other team by bigger margins.
05:55 Wed 4 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
But you see, you're thinking team fixtures=games
I believe frames=games
My way, noone goes unbeaten, everyone loses sometimes,
but when you count up a whole season, you really have something, an accurate representation of the best team, if bonus points don't get in the way.
C'mon, just drop it back to 10 like it was, worked so well, was a beautiful compromise, also seperated the league from the cup, made it different, more accurate.
If you go unbeaten in the league (even if you have lower frames for and lower frame difference) you still deserve to win the league.
But you see, you're thinking team fixtures=games
I believe frames=games
My way, noone goes unbeaten, everyone loses sometimes,
but when you count up a whole season, you really have something, an accurate representation of the best team, if bonus points don't get in the way.
C'mon, just drop it back to 10 like it was, worked so well, was a beautiful compromise, also seperated the league from the cup, made it different, more accurate.
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12:11 Wed 4 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
Mosconi cup, the superbowl, the premier league, stanley cup, the us open....the list is endless of competitions where it is not necessarily the team or individual that scores the most games/goals/ points that wins them. Sport is not a matter of how many of the above you win by but the fact that you win all your games. You win all your games as a team in any sport and you win whatever competition you are in. There is not one out there where you can lose a fixture and beat a team who won them all. That is the true test of who the best team is. Wether we win by 1 point or a hundred we deserve it because we didnt lose a fixture. Last year SS deserved the FBL title and as a member at the time It leaves a sour taste knowing that the team never lost and we won nothing for it.
Win as a team, lose as a team.
Win as a team, lose as a team.
14:04 Wed 4 Sep 13 (BST) [Link]
Mosconi cup, the superbowl, the premier league, stanley cup, the us open....the list is endless of competitions where it is not necessarily the team or individual that scores the most games/goals/ points that wins them. Sport is not a matter of how many of the above you win by but the fact that you win all your games. You win all your games as a team in any sport and you win whatever competition you are in. There is not one out there where you can lose a fixture and beat a team who won them all. That is the true test of who the best team is. Wether we win by 1 point or a hundred we deserve it because we didnt lose a fixture. Last year SS deserved the FBL title and as a member at the time It leaves a sour taste knowing that the team never lost and we won nothing for it.
every sport plays each tother twice or 3 times i know that is home and away but playing each other once isnt the wya u could play team 2nd in league when there not on form and not give them a chance for revenge when there playing better the way the fixtures work out id like to have a extended season
Win as a team, lose as a team.
every sport plays each tother twice or 3 times i know that is home and away but playing each other once isnt the wya u could play team 2nd in league when there not on form and not give them a chance for revenge when there playing better the way the fixtures work out id like to have a extended season
Win as a team, lose as a team.
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FCL League Discussion Thread (3)
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