World Cup 2014

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theshield
theshield
Posts: 31
04:39 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
So how does a 35 year old, who played 42 games for his club and doesn't get cramp in first match at World Cup but a 19 year old, who as played 34 games for his club ends up with cramp?


The 19 year old ran far further, is used to cooler weather, took more hits and the fewer games means he is more susceptible to cramp


The younger guys shouldn't be getting cramp no matter what, i never saw him get cramp playing for Liverpool and he played the game the same way right?
Deleted User
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04:44 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
We will NOT beat Uruguay - We needed minimum a draw tonight and Costa Rica were brilliant earlier, Joel Campbell some player and Bolanos, Bryan Ruiz were pretty good too.

We may as well hop on plane and return as Uruguay losing will only galvanize them and they purposely didn't play Luis Suarez today saving him for the England game...oh dear if Balotelli can breach our defence Imagine Cavani and Suarez - not looking good.

I dont understand why we didnt stick on a 3rd Striker, we needed a goal (Lambert)

Yes Chezz but anyone and everyone will pretend to be the England coach, it's systematic and it's a way of dealing with the result. So to say all that matters is the result in the top left hand corner is all well and good but to analyze and scrutinize how it happened is common place. Each to their own. I think we've blown our chances now.
zantetsukenz
zantetsukenz
Moderator
Posts: 19,967
04:51 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
So how does a 35 year old, who played 42 games for his club and doesn't get cramp in first match at World Cup but a 19 year old, who as played 34 games for his club ends up with cramp?


The 19 year old ran far further, is used to cooler weather, took more hits and the fewer games means he is more susceptible to cramp


The younger guys shouldn't be getting cramp no matter what, i never saw him get cramp playing for Liverpool and he played the game the same way right?


Of course he can, because he's ran himself ragged and had a game and a half. You never saw that because the climate in England was getting nowhere near what it is in Brazil now. Heat makes running so much harder, it's like running for an extra 15-30 minutes which is where you see cramp coming in
zantetsukenz
zantetsukenz
Moderator
Posts: 19,967
04:53 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
If the world cup so far is anything to go by, you can't write anyone off. Next set of games could change everything. Costa Rica will fancy their chances i'd say
theshield
theshield
Posts: 31
04:53 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
So how does a 35 year old, who played 42 games for his club and doesn't get cramp in first match at World Cup but a 19 year old, who as played 34 games for his club ends up with cramp?


The 19 year old ran far further, is used to cooler weather, took more hits and the fewer games means he is more susceptible to cramp


The younger guys shouldn't be getting cramp no matter what, i never saw him get cramp playing for Liverpool and he played the game the same way right?


Of course he can, because he's ran himself ragged and had a game and a half. You never saw that because the climate in England was getting nowhere near what it is in Brazil now. Heat makes running so much harder, it's like running for an extra 15-30 minutes which is where you see cramp coming in


Why didn't you see that from Candreva then as he was running all over England all night long?
zantetsukenz
zantetsukenz
Moderator
Posts: 19,967
04:55 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
He still didn't run anywhere near as much, or as fast as Sterling. Again, he plays in a hotter country too and didn't get the whacks Sterling did. It all adds up.
theshield
theshield
Posts: 31
04:55 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
He still didn't run anywhere near as much, or as fast as Sterling


Take those red tinted glasses off and stop defending him getting cramp
zantetsukenz
zantetsukenz
Moderator
Posts: 19,967
04:58 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
Take yours off then, he ran far further and faster than anyone else on the pitch for 90 minutes. The cramp came after contact and didn't really affect him. The Italians playing much more compact and defensive and not swapping wings did.
chezz
chezz
Posts: 1,074
05:02 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
Take yours off then, he ran far further and faster than anyone else on the pitch for 90 minutes. The cramp came after contact and didn't really affect him. The Italians playing much more compact and defensive and not swapping wings did.


Did anyonesee my post? lmao

Zante is right, i never saw pirlo sprint, and in all fairness, it's experience for him to know how to play effectively, they are 2 totaly different types of players, and sterling ran on every blade of grass, so for a youngster, its bound to happen
theshield
theshield
Posts: 31
05:28 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
Take yours off then, he ran far further and faster than anyone else on the pitch for 90 minutes. The cramp came after contact and didn't really affect him. The Italians playing much more compact and defensive and not swapping wings did.


Did anyonesee my post? lmao

Zante is right, i never saw pirlo sprint, and in all fairness, it's experience for him to know how to play effectively, they are 2 totaly different types of players, and sterling ran on every blade of grass, so for a youngster, its bound to happen


Explain Sturridge and Cahill getting cramp then as Pirlo most definitely covered more ground than both those two players
zantetsukenz
zantetsukenz
Moderator
Posts: 19,967
05:54 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
I did chezz

Sturridge looked like a knock, not cramp. Cahill isn't a younger player, the heat did affect him and a defender is never gonna be used to running like a midfielder is. Pirlo is running the show, not running around. He leaves that for other players.
erigert
erigert
Posts: 6,417
11:55 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
I did chezz

Sturridge looked like a knock, not cramp. Cahill isn't a younger player, the heat did affect him and a defender is never gonna be used to running like a midfielder is. Pirlo is running the show, not running around. He leaves that for other players.

dont think the problem why england is exhausted is the heat in Brazil. The temperature were around 20-25 degrees which is ideal for a football match. If England ever wants to win a World Cup, they will need to change the system of the league. Theres no chance for their players to be rested at mid june when the premier league never has a week off in december or january. Look at germanys teams how fresh they are in big tournaments.
the__priest
the__priest
Posts: 7,974
14:06 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
you can blame this and that and something else

the mixture od youth and experience was rally good


to me we had a constructive conversation about systems
where I was told this and that

I stated the following
1) 4-4-2 isn't the system we were playing

2) lack of natural width in the team

3) we were going to play straight down the middle which would play straight into the Italians strength

4) I was worried about the defensive cover proven right there to

the negative system we played killed me

4-2-3-1

Rooney didn't play bad at all, he is a number 10 all day
he proved quality width gets goals ( great cross )

Wellbeck answered everyone's opinions last night
he attacked won the ball and the game changed when he was taken off

Sterling really attack minded but always seem not to have an end product some bad decision making
however a real success ? I think so, but as a number 10 the minute Wellbeck went off it was a one man show he gave no quality or goals

Sturridge played very well linked up with Wellbeck and Sterling great goal that's his job
people were slating him in the friendly the other night
total joke
form is temporary class is forever

Henderson gutted for the lad, ran the show when he was allowed shackled to the floor made him look average, should've taken Gerrard off not Henderson

Gerrard shouldn't have been on the pitch don't want to make anymore comments on him
the__priest
the__priest
Posts: 7,974
14:12 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
I cannot believe Rooney being asked to cover Baines
this was a total joke

4-2-3-1

shows no natural width or defensive cover
this system leads disaster

Italy exposed yet again another player being played out of position

Rooney either plays behind Sturridge or simply don't play him, as one of the best players in the world why play him
so tight to the centre and leave such a big gap In between
Baines and Rooney

rhe Manager should've adjusted the system immediately
time and time again everyone in this country could see what was happening, let alone the Manager

very very worried about the next 2 games

we need natural width

and it was the coolest of days we will have
the next 2 are hot, humid games
Deleted User
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14:28 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
why all the doom and gloom, we didnt exactly play poor. Got beat due to italy bein more clinical. Sterling should of been taken off but to slate te lad for cramp is a joke, by far our best player and the only one who looked like he always had the beatin of their defence. Rooney one quality ball in but enough to carry on bein selected not for me. Poor subs aswell wilsire first touch poor ball out of play, would of been bringing on lambert aswell, ood finisher and we neesded a goal
Deleted User
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14:59 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
A lot of the criticism is unwarranted.

I personally didn't think Welbeck would quite cut it but was our second best player only to Sterling.

Candreva was pretty much unplayable last night, was absolutely fantastic.

Rooney should have been played behind Sturridge, and playing him out of position basically made sure Baines wasn't covered and we weren't as clinical in attack, took a lot away from us. We have plenty players who can play attacking Left/Right mid in Sterling Welbeck Lallana Henderson can do a shift there, Milner can the ox when he is back. There is no need at all to play Wayne Rooney there.

Johnson had about his best game for England in the past year, other than a misplaced pass or cross he never done much more wrong than anyone else, yet there is still a hate campaign about him.

I would play exactly the same team vs Uruguay, only put Sterling on the left and Rooney behind the striker, maybe give Rooney a free role behind Sturridge and ahead of Gerrard let him do his thing and be the best he can for us, would give us an extra man in mid when needed and he would be in a more favourable attacking role for himself too.

Plus Sterling on the left when they have just lost their first choice right back will be frightening for them, plus he is used to helping back and defending as he normally tracks back for Liverpool.

Could possiby play a 4-4-1-1 or 4-4-2 also with Rooney either partnering Sturridge or roaming between attack and mid.
Deleted User
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15:04 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
Positives:

The best England display for a long time.
Good to see us retain the possession
Looked like we had some threat
Defence looked in control, Cahill and Jagielka didn't really do much wrong, Candreva's cross were pinpoint and if Beckham had done it, we would be marvelling it.
Looked interested for a change
Played for full 90 mins and not just 1 half.

Negatives:

Rooney out of natural position
No width due to having no wingers
Incorrect subs, Lambert should have been used
Gerard looked Ineffective he's an attacking midfielder not a defensive one.
Gerard looked like struggled with the humidity the most
Glen Jonhson is useless!
Uruguay losing to an unexpected team, they will have be very wounded and purposely didn't play Suarez

Come on England, but going to be a very tall order to beat the Uruguayans in their continent.
Deleted User
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15:43 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
Gerrard played as a defensive midfielder for the last part of the season for Liverpool, and was very effective. The fact that Italy had more men in midfield is probably the reason Gerrard looked ineffective.

Johnson had a decent game last night and didn't do much wrong, probably had a better game than Baines did, than Rooney did, and we make excuses up for them two?

I agree Johnson has been rubbish of late but last night he was actually quite good, beating men good passes and creating some chances, linking up with well with whoever was on his wing.
franer_
franer_
Posts: 2,717
16:02 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
Engerlost Engerlost Engerlosttt

Engerlost and as i stated will have a ton of pressure on them to qualify..ooooppps.

Play rooney and sturridge up front as a pair..flat 4-4-2 ...then use lallana even milner out there. with gerrard and hendo in mid.

lambert as a sub for rooney and barkley for hendo..

attack attack attack its your best hope now.
Deleted User
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16:03 Sun 15 Jun 14 (BST)  [Link]  
Gerrard played as a defensive midfielder for the last part of the season for Liverpool, and was very effective. The fact that Italy had more men in midfield is probably the reason Gerrard looked ineffective.

Johnson had a decent game last night and didn't do much wrong, probably had a better game than Baines did, than Rooney did, and we make excuses up for them two?

I agree Johnson has been rubbish of late but last night he was actually quite good, beating men good passes and creating some chances, linking up with well with whoever was on his wing.


Baines were disappointing, problem we have is Shaw wouldn't be any better defensively, we missed an Ashley Cole i feel. Rooney - It's not really fair to judge someones performance when played out of natural position.

Yeah Johnson when he has the ball most the time I predict he'll lose possession or kick it out with an awful attempt of a cross. He wasn't the worst player on the pitch, most ineffective were Baines and Gerard. Not once did I see Gerard get in to a position to strike at goal, that were disappointing as he's got a great shot on him.
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World Cup 2014

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